We’re very excited to show you the final logo that we’ve gone with.
We’ve shown you quite a number of iterations and doodles that the agency, IdoIdea, experimented with. The final concept of the logo shows our involvment in the creative and design community by subtly using the colours that designers work with ALL the time – CMYK and RGB. The font is clean and understated in order to take a backseat from the rest of the design – We didn’t want to overpower the site with one logo, and felt that it should take a backseat so as not to distract from the content on the site. Kind of like wearing a dress that’s not as flash as the bride at a wedding. We’re very happy with the design, and feel that the response from you guys has been great as well, we’ve gotten some GREAT feedback, and we’ve also made some last minute tweaks here and there based on this. As one commentator said, “Don’t design by committee” – we were happy that we didn’t send out an open brief (some people were expecting this), but we’re confident that the logo reflects the spirit behind Between 10 and 5.
CLICK THROUGH FOR THE LOGO.
Remember your comments on the logo can still win you a super cool 2Bop t-shirt!
71 Comments
At first glance it reads: 1Oand5, because of the same font size (10,5 + “and”) the “0″ looks like an “O”.
The uneven line weight and kerning on the name (10and5) is a bit disturbing.
wow, these responses are bordering on the outrage surrounding the 2012 london olympics logo. but, i agree. i am not too fond of this, even though the influence from billboard is not direct, it is undeniable, even at a subconscious level.
i did expect something else, considering the drafts we all saw. congrats on getting to a point you are happy with, even if the ‘community’ aren’t all that chuffed…
Jacoba, I find your argument a bit weak. When George Bush told his countrymen they needed a war in Iraq, people around the world disagreed, but like it or don’t like it, it kinda stuck.
Although the logo is generating fantastic buzz for 10&5, the community has not responded favourably, resulting in a near 2:1 ratio against it. Perhaps there has been so much debate about the new logo because the community feels very strongly about this blog?
C’mon! Surely the blog representing the South African creative industry can come up with a better logo…
…or have you duped us and the true logo is yet to be revealed?
Nope Ernst and all, this is the chosen one. Yep, its been an eye opener, and maybe i should actually take up violin or something instead of design/advertising. Maybe i didn’t follow enough rules and old outdated design regulations… maybe i didn’t look through enough fonts, of which i have almost 10,000. Maybe i didn’t read the brief thoroughly enough… and maybe i need to go back to the 10and5 drawing board.
But no, i stick to my guns. I read the brief. The requests were understood, and the logo designed. I was quite happy to show the boys, and the boys digged it. Brief answered.
This amount of hype/finger-pointing would have happened to anyone who opened themselves to it like i have to Creative or non-creative criticism. This industry is fraught with it… and i’ve taken it all in my stride.
I’ve seen some “dubbed” good and bad logo’s, for many reasons, but it is what it is guys and girls. I’ll never make the perfect logo, or dream up the hottest campaign. No-one is perfect, and no design is perfect… thats the beauty. Revel in the difference… it’s what makes this world and the people in it, unique.
So, with that long soppy vent, i personally hope, that in the same amount of time i would have to drink between 10 and 5 beers, everyone who commented here take up the mouse, and design their very own – to showcase right here… lets see what you guys got up your sleeves.
I’m not loving the idea that is being put forward here, that graphic design, or more specifically, typography is some kind of intuitive pastime with ‘no rules’, especially on a site that represents the professional design community. To me this is a regressive and almost philistine sentiment that is an argument for amateurism.
The history of typography goes back to the mid-15th century – and mark making is as old as civilisation itself. Beauty in typography, as with almost every form of human endeavour, comes from the rigorous application of concepts that have been distilled, experimented with and applied over many hundreds of years.
When I look at the new Between 10 and 5 logo, I just don’t feel the same sense of typographical lineage, technical excellence or craftsmanship that I see in the work of Joe Fino, Massimo Vignelli or Tobias Frere-Jones. These and many other graphic and type designers are not successful because they slavishly follow a set of ‘design rules’, rather their work is often the result of disciplined exploration of various theses, or solutions to technical or creative challenges.
Sean-o, when you dismiss, ‘rules and old outdated design regulations’, you make it sound like you are branching out on your own unique, expressive, avant-garde experiment that should somehow not be subject to the same discipline, or open to the same critique, as other designers. Sadly this is not the case.
Jon Wozencroft argues that even experimental typography must come from a background of rigourous discipline; “The part discipline plays in experimentation can be likened to the role of improvisation in music – before this can happen with any degree of accomplishment, you have to know your instrument inside out.”
I find it hard to believe that you really stand by your statement that, “no design is perfect… thats the beauty.” Imagine if that thinking was applied to ballet. Prima ballerinas being dropped on their heads or tripping over each other would and should not be celebrated. What is charming in the work of 8 year old loses its appeal in the professional world.
Bollocks – the Iraq war can certainly not be compared to a creation – the ony thing it did was to create wealth for Bush et al. I like the logo, I think it’ll work and frankly, I’m surprised at the all the negativity! The logo has to work for this site – but I’m thrilled that they moved away from the stereotypical “let’s be like the Jones’ next door” attempts that are visible on so many sites.
I recall the same kind of hysteria when a cake shop in Cape Town refused to stick to the rigid grey or white walls, wooden floors and de rigeur furniture and decided to paint the building pink.
Ballet or maths cannot be likened to typography … puhleez!
It’s an art form and art should never have rigid rules. Van Gogh had a helluva time because he also refused to stick to rigid rules! And look what happened there. So did many other great artists, chefs, musicians ……. since when is typography, like maths and science, dependent absolutely on the rules and regulations of one or two self proclaimed masters?
microsoft released comic sans and, it kind of stuck.
get a hold of yourselves, people. this is a logo, not a Turner prize candidate. FFS. go work in a soup kitchen.
the way people are gaaning on about the professional this and professional that … is really so overstated… get a grip people the logo is fun and it works so it may not be what you want… but what is… so an idea comes to mind maybe 10and5 should post prospective logo designs and get the users to vote for their favourite…hmmm sounds like fun
WOW! .. Some good points . However this post has turned negative in my opinion and quoting design theory is not going to make the other party see your point. Its a pity as it was a good debate. I agree with Damian that you need to be sound in the principles of design before you can extend them and “break” them, and i think if we were looking at something really cutting edge and progressive the argument for “old outdated rules” would have been valid. But as it stands the design adheres to certain design principles and doesn’t break any conventions as far as i can see.Carson and Brody had credibility as both were familiar with the rules when they decided to break them, this design unfortunately does not break any rules of design and does not render those rules outdated and old.
I do however thing that by doing a logo for this site Sean took a huge risk. Designing for the design “community” is always hard and you will always attract critics. Im sure he was aware of the risks going into this job. I do think that some of the comments on this blog are valid but i draw the line at personal attacks and holier than thou attitudes. Im sure we all have work in our portfolios that we think is good, but is in fact rubbish in other peoples eyes. If you really take exception to this design perhaps its time to put your money where your mouth is and pull out your own designs for the “community” to crit.
thanks for reading my 2 cents
Can’t believe people are losing sleep over this and posting comments at 2:44 am! WTF?
Have a look at this article written by Khoi Vinh. I think it’s very relevant to this debate and he raises some very interesting points.
http://www.subtraction.com/2009/04/09/dear-designer-you-suck
Matt thanks for that link – it is very relevant and I suggest everyone give it a good read!
In the meantime, we’re asking that we close this discussion for now – we’ll leave the commenting open, but ask that you please refrain from making any personal comments (thanks for calling everyone on that Dylan), but rather use our logo feedback form to leave any opinions, we’ve made a follow up post here: http://www.10and5.com/2009/05/logo-response-feedback/ or answer the survey here:
http://www.surveygizmo.com/s/137050/between-10-and-5-logo-feedback
Once again – thanks for the great feedback!
i think it’s time for a new post and let’s discuss everything we LIKE about this logo.
Thanks Natali, you can post any new comments up here: here
Thanks for posting that article Matt.
I’m amazed that so many people feel inspired to write stuff along the lines of, ‘hey, don’t take this stuff so seriously – it’s only a logo’, or ‘let’s be positive’.
Firstly, design is our work and something we are passionate about – of course we take it seriously!
Secondly, what is the point of having a design community if we cannot critique each others work? I thought that was the whole point of this exercise. If we are just going to pat each other on the back all the time how are we going to grow?
This kind of critique is a discussion. If you disagree with what is being said, put forward a counter-argument.
I haven’t seen any personal attacks on this thread. Taking a criticism personally is something different all together.
Uno, I have to say that it’s a bit strange to open something up to the public for discussion, then ask people to stop discussing it (or comment less). However, it’s your site so I’ll respect your wishes
Hey Damian, we don’t want to turn down the comments – that’s why we’re keeping it open. We do however want to channel the energy that everyone has, and the strong opinions into something positive.
I’m a big follower of the school of thought that one needs to take all criticism and critique, so I’m definitely not discouraging people from posting any new feedback. Please keep that coming. But we do want to get a bit deeper feedback through the survey – it’s our way to try quantify the feelings out there at the moment.
Reading that article by Khoi Vinh makes total sense in this situation – we really need more constructive crit, and not just patting on the back. I appreciate all the feedback – positive and negative.
As an aside – we have moderated only 1 comment that we felt was inappropriate and not adding any value.
A wise old copywriter once told me that you can only break the rules once you’ve learned to obey them. The further I walk on this journey in the professional creative field, the more I understand what she meant.
And Sean-o, remember, obstruction breeds ingenuity.
I likes it,
Its a lot cleaner than some of the other logos and a bit more mature.
Gets o the point. Between 5 AND 10.
Mr T approves.
Logo is nicer than the previous ones…
but it looks verrry similar to this http://www.fastcompany.com/files/MCP-100_0.jpg . Well something…
i-D